"Jasper's" Posts on Ex-Premie Forum - 2009

In 2009, "Jasper", a former follower of Prem Rawat's aka Maharaji, who had spent considerable personal time with him albeit in a servant/Master role began to post about his experiences on the Prem Rawt Talk Forum. Remember, these posts were a work-in-progress, similar to a person waking up from a 35 year long dream and gradually reconnecting with reality.

A collected and collated series of Jasper's other posts are available at:

10th August 2009 - ..and now what are your comments on the 14 objections

This is my first post, but after 34 years I just could not be fooled any longer, or put another way, fool myself any longer. The last straw came when I was driving him a couple of years ago, which I had done at least 100 times before, over about a 16 year time frame. He stumbled off his plane and as I held the door to the car for him, he walked into me totally drunk. After getting him safely in the middle of the back seat, I drove him about 20 minutes to one of his houses, and the entire time he was laughing hysterically. Only it wasn't a funny kind of laugh. Instead, it was a maniacal, nasty, put one over on everyone, jokes on you, kind of laugh. I have never heard anything like it and he just could not control himself. Sitting there, drunk, he was laughing at me, at you, at everybody and everything, in a way that was saying "fooled ya, you bunch of idiots". It was an absolutely chilling experience that I will never forget.

Then of course he had his girlfriend waiting for him, neatly set up in a just far enough away neighboring house for the week. We weren't supposed to notice that, and I guess if we did, it was understood that it was OK because he's just perfect, right? If you really are perfect, then permission is automatically granted to do anything you want. Perfect is above accountability. Sadly I was staying at the guest house at his Malibu family home shortly after and saw his wife, Marolyn. She was drunk too, and behaving not very Holy Mother-like at the time. Funny thing, I just felt kind of bad for her, in that maybe she had been fooled the most of all.

The point is, how does any of that align with ANY of his ever changing brand remakes; Lord of the Universe, Perfect Master, Teacher, Millenium Man, Humanitarian, Benefactor? They all by definition, contain some degree of moral fabric and decency. Maybe that's what he was laughing about; that he has fooled so many of us, in so many ways, for so long. Well, right now, I'm feeling the jokes on him.

11th August 2009 - Re: Chilling post

Thank you all for your responses to my earlier post. There is certainly no shortage of passion here! I also fully appreciate some of the responses containing a good dose of healthy doubt. It is very reassuring that many of us have reconnected with THAT valuable mental resource which can guide us towards making intelligent, rational, and well informed decisions. I could have used a little more doubt in the early 70's. Maybe it would have helped me avoid a three and a half decade diversion into the deep recesses of "Maharaji"s World." For now, I wanted to mostly just say that. It was not so easy to burst forth with my previous comments, and yes, that story is shocking and unbelievable. But who would possibly believe or want to believe any of this? Foot kissing, arm waving, firehose dousings, group chanting, orange robed Mahatma priests, aril; all the while being pressured into offering up ridiculous sums of money to a fat Indian kid who actually pulled off the idea of constructing a toll booth between me and God on the road to salvation!

12th August 2009 - Re: Dear Jasper,

Thanks Lakeshore, and thanks to everyone for an exciting and warmly received entry to the forum. Feels good to have some folks who understand and can provide support as I slowly wake up from a weird dream. Its been a little disorienting and not so easy. Almost everything I've believed in heart and soul for most of my life was exposed as a deceptive lie. At the same time I have found a whole new world to discover and explore. There are some wonderful people scattered around out there who are a real joy to get to know. I'm also more aware of the type of people who will say or do anything to manipulate others for THEIR own benefit. In that regard, Rawat was a great teacher. If nothing else, I think I'm learning to try to take an honest look at things and see them how they really are. Sometimes its beautiful, sometimes its pretty ugly; but there has been a basic, simple, feeling of being grounded in acceptance of the truth about the way things are. Guess I'm talking about truth with a little "t". It goes back to the idea that there is a certain moral compass that is read by a conscience that instinctively knows the difference between right and wrong, and is inside most of us. Then there are the Rawats of the world who were seemingly born without one. Guess what made me finally speak out, was taking a good look at the direction of the compass needle, moving in the direction of what my instincts were saying was right, and not being afraid of exposing that which was flat out wrong. Cheeeezzz; will somebody please help me down from this soapbox???!!!

14th August 2009 - Re: I listened to Rawat today

About a month ago I did an experiment on myself and sat down to watch a scheduled "Words of Peace" broadcast to see what would happen to me. Pretty amazing, because within a couple of minutes I had entered into a trance-like state that felt very familiar. Everything in the room started to fade away, I wasn't really registering the words he was saying, my body became kind of numb, and it was really like being hypnotized. When I realized what had happened I started to listen to the tone and cadence of his voice and and the fluctuations in volume and repetitive nature of his phrases. No doubt, my mind had been trained to become subject to being controlled by Rawat whenever he spoke, after years of repeated programing. In fact, I had learned to identify this state as some higher level of consciousness, and actually craved getting back to it like an addictive drug. And it was only possible to trigger that state by hearing Rawat speak. Hence, the feeling for years, that if enough time went by without hearing or seeing him speak, I'd soon be commiserating with other premies by expressing the idea, "man do I ever need to get to a program."

Back to the experiment. As I forced myself to snap out of the trance, and stopped observing the effects of his voice, I began listening to his actual words. It was all just a bunch of examples that really had no meaning or rational point. He gave some kind of profoundly phrased comparison of a bird to a kite but the example didn't connect to anything and therefore just made no sense. The context of the entire rest of the speech was just a series of disconnected and incomplete comparisons, all of which added up to a whole lot of nothing.

When I thought back to the first part of the experiment, the difference was shocking. Then I began to think about how Rawat had carefully defined these two states as Heart and Mind. Heart was good; "good premie. You will be

rewarded with enlightenment if you keep going like this". Mind was bad; "bad premie, you are crap but if you submit you still may have a chance by the grace of Rawat." It became clear that hypnosis and trance triggered by Rawat's voice, and reinforced by reward and guilt were the essence of "satsang and programs."

Of course I had also been trained to believe that this kind of thoughtful analysis was called "Doubt". And since doubt was bad, it would trigger guilt which would circle back to submission to Rawat as the only way out, and the only way to "Good". It always circled back around to Rawat as the answer.

Holy crap!!! Anyway this may all just be review for some of you veterans with time away from the cult, but for me it was a shocking revelation and for the first time I really understood all of this. That was one of the final realizations I think I needed to have to be able to let loose with a post, and really make a break for freedom. Thanks for helping me find my way out!

15th August 2009 - Brief look from the other side.

About 6 years ago I was at a 3 day program with the standard 2 a day satsangs, plus various meetings in between. One of the meetings I was to attend, was by invitation only, with a circulated buzz that Rawat just might surprise us all and grace us with his presence. There were about 100 or so elite class premies granted this highly special and privileged opportunity. The night before I was particularly honored by being asked by a superior if I would share a few words about my experience of Knowledge and Maharaji in front of the group. I distinctly remember the strange mix of thoughts and feelings that immediately began to churn around inside of me; pride, fear, disbelief, wonder, more fear. At the same time I remember hearing myself, the "Good premie", spout out, "Yes glad to do it!" Apparently after years of being considered too incompetent to speak publicly, Rawat had lifted the ban, and was going to allow selected premies the rare chance to share a few words under specially controlled circumstances. That night I went through a bit of a struggle trying not to think about what I would say the next day. Mind would not be needed or desired. This was a surefire time to just trust in the grace. Don't think I actually slept at all.

The meeting began with a couple of warm up videos then suddenly I was asked, without much introduction, to step up and say a few words. In a semi-trance like state, while trying to remain absorbed in my own breathing, I walked up to the podium and looked out at the group. The feeling was incredible. I had done a good bit of public speaking through my work, but never had I seen such an attentive group. As I began to speak, they literally hung on to every word, gesture, expression, and inflection. If I laughed, they laughed. If I swayed to the left, they followed. If I frowned, they did the same. Didn't matter so much WHAT I said. It was more like there was an unspoken idea that I was up there as Maharaji's specially selected agent and therefore was appointed to transmit or channel his wishes to the group. No one wanted to take the chance they would miss out on collecting a few more credits or poker chips towards enlightenment. They/we had all obviously been highly trained and conditioned to sit there and somehow just melt into putty that could be molded by the speaker. It was absolutely incredible. I will never forget the exhilarating experience of power that was available to me at that moment, supplied by the full submission and concentration of that group of 100. In case you're still wondering, no, he did not show up that time.

The content of my speech was pretty simple but received rave reviews and high fives for months. Some premies said it was one of the best they had heard. It went something like this; " Ha Ha Ha I'm such an IDIOT! and oh my God, Maharaji is sooooooo PERFECT! Boy do I ever need his grace. I'm going to really try to be a really GOOD premie so I don't get left behind! and you should probably all do the same. Thank you."

A couple of years later I was at a twilight "Expressions" program in the amphitheater at Amaroo. As a reminder, that's where premie after premie gets their hands on a microphone and gushes all over the rest of us about just how much they need and appreciate Rawat, and how much his gift has blah blah blah… Personally I really could not stand these types of programs. But on this night I was sitting close and got a good look at Rawat as he sat and literally fed off of one premie after another, while the microphone was delicately passed around. As I watched him, I thought back to that feeling I had in front of that relatively small group of premies, and connected the two with a pretty profound understanding of what it must be like for him to sit up there, especially knowing the kind of person he really is. He must be experiencing some vampire-like transfusion of other's souls with an absolutely intoxicating effect. He's probably more addicted to that experience than we ever were to the hypnotic trance-like state of satsang. Besides needing an endless fresh supply of expensive material objects, and the glamor of having lots of money, I'll bet he NEEDS a regular feeding from premies at programs, just to get a satisfying fix.

23rd August 2009 - Re: The disgraceful concept of "Grace"

Thanks Cynthia for posting and the Joe Whalen articles. These really sum it up. I've been thinking a lot about the difference between "What" Rawat has done and ''Who" he is. In other words, once we understand the horrific nature of his crime, it naturally leads to the question, ''Who would possibly do such a thing?" His crime is clearly evident through his behavior and through the creation of his cult. The damage is the incredible psychological slaughter and spiritual rape of his innocent victims plus his continuous theft by deception of money, goods, and services. The weight of the evidence clearly shows he's guilty beyond any shadow of a doubt. Anyone who objectively even considers the evidence, will quickly understand how Rawat will say or do anything, with NO consideration for the true welfare or expense of ANYONE else, to serve his own insatiable need for money and adoration.

But "Who" is the person behind this psychopathic behavior? Rawat goes to extreme lengths to prevent exposing himself. He hides behind a well rehearsed public facade. His scam is meticulously crafted, but there are occasional slips and small cracks, that reveal his true, evil, character. Sitting alone, drunk, and laughing AT us all, while feeling very self satisfied for fooling a bunch of idiots, is a pretty big clue. My guess is that this type of exposure is where he is the most vulnerable.

Real justice would be the unraveling of Rawat, which means he is bankrupt with no followers, and left facing a life of ridicule and scorn for his crimes against society and his innocent victims who are simply trying to find peace or God.

24th August 2009 - The price that is paid.

"cause all other loves fail. They're there and then they go away, they're there and then they go away"

Who would ever say such a thing? To put this in perspective, something that fails could be seen as a lost cause. Does that mean that all relationships that involve love, are a lost cause and will fail? Does that mean that something that goes away is a failure? Since everything goes away eventually, then according to Rawat, its all a failure anyway, so why bother? The only thing that remains for the true believer is HIM, which is exactly the way he wants it. Its not just his words and the way he twists things that are damaging. Its the entire effect of the Cult, its underlying strategy and purpose, and the effect it has on those who are seduced by him.

Its the price that is paid by innocent people like Cynthia's friend and family that is really the horrific part of what Rawat is doing. How do you repair the kind of damage that was inflicted on this daughter and her parents? How many times has this type of damage been done? Or even worse types of damage? Rawat needs to be exposed as the Predator he is; he will say or do ANYTHING to promote himself for money or adoration.

25th August 2009 - Re: the shifting winds

Agree completely! I remember attending an instructor training session where Rawat had decided it was OK for him to smoke publicly in front of his followers. In somewhat comic style, it seemed like nearly everyone took up the habit, even those who might not have ever considered smoking before. It got a little hard to breathe in there! Since he can do no wrong, any behavior he engages in can be seen as right. Why not do as he does? In the case above, I'm sure the conclusion was made in some minds, that smoking in the presence of Rawat, or remembering the breath while smoking, would miraculously neutralize the possibility of lung cancer!!!

25th August 2009 - Re: Footage of the young master

Rawat's childhood has obviously shaped and influenced his character, as it does with anyone. He was taught at a very young age, that its all a big charade. He has officially been appointed to be the rightful center of attention. Of course he should be adored without question, and be granted the gift of having anything he wants. Others are there to provide for him. In return he may choose to bless them with some form of acknowledgement, or he may choose not to. He is above reproach and accountability.

The problem is that his charade causes severe and often irreparable damage to innocent people who are seduced by his charm and deceptive control. He poses a real threat that needs to be exposed. We all have stories about those who have been hurt psychologically, emotionally, financially, or have had otherwise healthy relationships torn apart. Worst of all is the demented perspective ingrained in his followers (me/us). It coats life itself with a toxic residue that can even contaminate our relationship with God. Seems like its a lot more significant than an adult-aged, misguided child, who is behaving badly.

28th August 2009 - Re: Stark Reality

"How do you think one would go about confronting the stark reality between who Rawat presents himself to be and who he actually is?"

Rawat is a liar, plain and simple. His lies are huge. So huge in fact, that to believe him, it requires that the believer adjust their perception, analytical thinking processes, decision making ability, and ultimately their REALITY. To support one lie, another must be manufactured, then another, and another, and another. The believer ends up swimming in lies, and the biggest of all is that it involves the essence of Truth. The thread that connects the lies is that Rawat bestows priceless Gifts. The giver (Rawat), maintains power and control, while the receiver (us), submits.

Rawat's lies are hidden behind a grand charade. It is meticulously crafted and conducted with precision. He lives a secluded life except for his occasional staged appearances. Even behind his protective veil, where few are allowed to enter, he tries to uphold the appearance of having profound wisdom, while performing his character role as "Master". His charade is so convincing to those who are vulnerable and seduced by his lies, that at times, even HE believes it. For years, I'm certain his own wife was fooled into believing in Rawat's grandiose delusion.

Doubt - "uncertainty of belief or opinion; a condition causing uncertainty, hesitation, or distrust; an inclination not to believe or accept." (Miriam-Webster's Dictionary)

Doubt is a healthy human instinctual defense mechanism. By definition, it is a hesitation or inclination to pause BEFORE believing or accepting. Doubt basically tells us to use our tools of perception and analytical thinking before we make a decision to believe or accept. Doubt helps keep us safe. Yet in Rawat's dogma, it is the first thing that has to go. Why? Because, if we actually listened to the cautionary voice of doubt, we would NEVER believe in his lies or be fooled by his charade.

Back to the question; which can now be restated by asking, "how can a believer see through the lies and charade, to expose and therefore understand, who the real Rawat actually is?" Implied in the question, is the idea that if the believer can actually see through to the real Rawat, his hoax will be self evident, the spell will be broken, and the believer will finally be set free. This question is so profound, it goes right to the heart of the purpose of this forum.

Looking back, for me, the instinct of Doubt was never fully obliterated. Doubt was only sequestered in a deep dark recess of my mind. Thousands of hours of active training and years of intense programming only served to contain doubt and not eradicate it. There was just enough left to serve me well. In fact, I have now come to understand that doubt was working for me all along. At times, while active in the cult, something would happen that just made no sense. But through training and indoctrination, as soon as I would begin to shake my head and ask what?, why?, huh?, doubt would be forcibly overruled. Compliance and submission to the teachings and pressures of the cult would automatically take over. But these questionable events were registered, recorded, and accumulated in the stored memory of my mind. The dots were there, but just not connected.

For me, a couple of events occurred that were so impressionable, the ingrained process of ignoring doubt, simply failed. Doubt crept in like a default, and it boldly alerted me to wake up and pay attention. I just couldn't ignore or deny the INCONSISTENCY of what I was personally experiencing with Rawat, (who he presents himself to be) and his actions and behavior (who he really is). It was like the lights were turned on and I was suddenly looking at ALL those dots. A distinct pattern appeared that was so clear I could not deny what I was seeing. Somehow I was able to find the courage to take a good look. Three things happened simultaneously: I clearly saw the obvious nature of Rawat's lies and charade, I was overcome by the raw emotion of having been maliciously deceived for 34 years (at an unimaginable cost), and while desperately struggling, grabbed on to the glimmer of HOPE that there might just be a way out.

There is a seemingly endless array of dots that could each be described at length. I will close with the story of one dot I will never forget, but first a little background. For a period of 5 long years I had been faced with an enormous personal challenge and crisis. We all face tough times, some more than others. But without going into details, please trust that this was of considerable magnitude. The best word to describe how I felt is "grief." True grief is so devastating it just cannot be understood by explanation. Those who have experienced it will know immediately what I mean. Those who have not are simply fortunate. I had been granted the incredible opportunity to be completely alone with Rawat, and with great anticipation, eagerly awaited my chance to talk to him. At what felt like the right moment, I somehow mustered the courage to ask for his wisdom, advice, and yes, even His Blessing. After all, he had been absolutely everything to me, and I thoroughly and deeply believed he was God incarnate. In fact, I distinctly remember feeling that, in spite of the circumstances, I alone, was at that moment, the single luckiest soul in the entire Universe. He would surely know more than anyone, what to say to me. With carefully chosen words, I asked for his help.

He paused for a few seconds, looked away, and then quickly rattled off the words, "Don't let it get to you." Upon sensing my dismay, he repeated more firmly, "Don't let it get to you." Then utter silence. He had no more to say.

Later I realized what he meant by that. It really had nothing to do with compassion, understanding, kindness, love, peace, or anything else that Rawat pretends to represent. It had nothing to do with why I followed him or why I believed in any of it for most of my life. But it did clearly reveal his ultimate agenda as I now know it to be; "Don't let it get to you. Don't let it get to you….. just keep living the lie, believe in the charade, and it will all be OK."

8th September 2009 - Re: TPRF Financials

Hello everybody; been busy but have kept up reading all of your posts. Thanks for keeping up the steady flow of good information.

I spent a good bit of time reviewing the TPRF website and they apparently are required to come clean with financial information, so some of it is there. What gets me about the whole foundation is that it's just a well concealed front for more of Rawat's extravagant self promoting expenditures. The latest information on the website is from 2007, where 41% of TPRF's revenue was spent on "efforts to further the message of Prem Rawat." Included in this broad category are magazines, online newsletters, DVD's, CD's, webcasts, and speaking engagements for Prem Rawat around the world. "Speaking engagements" could basically include anywhere or anytime Rawat talks to somebody. The total spent to "further the message" was almost $1 million in 2007. This was the major category of expenses and 3% more than was spent on the foundation's total "humanitarian initiatives"!

Nobody can fault or criticize the efforts to feed hungry people or hand out eyeglasses. But the greater mission of TPRF is clearly to promote Rawat, and cover expenditures to rebrand him as a selfless humanitarian whose sole purpose is to spread "Dignity, Peace, and Prosperity" to the world. I'd also bet that included in these expenses is some serious change to support his high roller life style and private jet-setting to some of his favorite stop overs.

Its just so transparent from outside of the cult. It's really quite shocking to imagine how bold and blatant Rawat is in manipulating his devoted followers. I was invited to dozens of private functions with Rawat, where he would mingle amongst his major donors who provided most of the money to support him and the cult. These were otherwise intelligent and respectable people who would be instantly transformed in his presence, into mindless drones, who would pour out money for anything Rawat wanted! Rawat's conniving manipulation and abuse of those donors does little for their Dignity or Prosperity. I guess if Peace is becoming a mindless drone while having your pocket picked, then there is at least some benefit to it for those poor souls.

9th September 2009 - Re: TPRF Financials

Thanks Cynthia on both points. And I'm not kidding about what would happen at these private events. It was like a magic spell was cast on those in attendance when Rawat would show up. He'd usually make some kind of grand entrance after an obligatory time period of anticipation. As soon as the buzz got around that he was actually there, in physical form, a distinct shift in the behavior of the guests occurred. Those closest to Rawat would crowd around him with a certain amount of respectful nudging, neck stretching, and jockeying for position. Rawat would typically look for a familiar face and address that fortunate individual with some tongue in cheek derogatory insult. In response, comments like, "Oh Maharaji" or "Thank you Maharaji" were offered up. He'd stroll around while being followed by a wave of, and I mean it, otherwise intelligent and respectful people who were behaving at that moment like mindless drones. This always happened and never ceased to amaze me. After a while there were some informal "rules" spread around that attempted to stop the crowding syndrome, so that Rawat could be more comfortable as he strolled about and could interact with more people. As soon as he left, usually in similar grand fashion, the group would return to normal, except for the resulting flurry of comments about how lucky and privileged everybody was. I've never seen anything like this and just thinking about it gives me a sick feeling in my stomach. How could we follow him so blindly? Yorum was usually around, chatting it up with the wealthiest donors, to encourage larger donations.

9th September 2009 - Re: Thanks to you too LP!!!

When I write these posts and know you guys are listening and can understand, it is a tremendous release. Somehow it makes it possible for these amorphous wads of pent up thoughts and emotion to take form. Then I can better see them for what they are, and let them go. Kind of like blowing up balloons and then watching them float away. And yes I know Steve and hope the best for him.

10th September 2009 - Re: His simple message has a simple truth that is difficult to argue against.?

"Do you think Premies and new recruits stay away from this site? What is your take on that Jasper? How do most followers view this site today?"

Looking back, it took me about 2 solid years to have a significant break through and finally turn my back on Rawat and start to walk away. I remember being simultaneously curious but terrified of the ex-premie website. One night I was just skipping around on the computer and the idea popped in my head that I ought to take a look at it. My rationale at the time was that, as a good premie, maybe it would be helpful to understand what these ex's were saying. That way I'd be prepared, just in case I was called upon at some point, to neutralize any comments or arguments that challenged Rawat or the Cult. Several hours later, and realizing I'd just lost about a half nights sleep, I dragged myself away from my computer and spent a restless couple of hours in bed. Following that, I swore off going back to the website intuitively knowing that there was now a crack ih my armor. Any more of that stuff and I just might start believing it myself! After all I had been thoroughly warned about the devastating threat posed by doubt, knew what it was, and understood the threat to my inner peace and fulfillment that doubt presented. It was to be avoided at all costs.

The next time I was with Rawat it felt a little different. As I talked to him in the car, it became more evident that almost everything he said was critical and condescending. I also started to notice more clearly the many inconsistencies in his behavior and actions. Some of the premies I knew that were traveling with him just seemed really checked out. Part of me thought, maybe they had progressed in their practice of Knowledge to a higher level of realization that awaited me too if only I continued with diligence. At the same time, another part of me was repelled by the fear that I'd be dealt the same degenerative fate if I stuck around. The extravagance, lavish spending, and obsessiveness surrounding Rawat started to feel repulsive. I remember thinking to myself towards the end that I just didn't like him very much.

There were a couple of memorable moments where I had a distinct feeling of disgust about what I was witnessing. One day, I was supposed to drive Marolyn to the airport while Rawat drove in another expensive car he had just bought. Of course all of the details had to be meticulously planned well ahead of time, for this short 10 minute drive. It was always like that. Anytime Rawat would be transported there was a grand yet secretive spectacle involving back up cars, rituals with baggage, maps and routing, impeccable timing, etc. All of that seemed reasonable however, as part of my discipline and training for the privileged service I was so fortunate to be assigned. But what got me that day was the car seat for the Dog. I'd never seen one, had no idea how to install it, but was told to hook this thing up quickly because Rawat wanted to get going. I remember feeling enormous pressure to get that dog seat buckled up properly. Although Rawat wasn't standing there breathing down my neck, I knew he was nearby counting every slow moving second and fuming over my apparent incompetence. It didn't matter how many years or endless hours I had spent helping him in the past, at that moment he was displeased with me and I could feel it. Finally I gave up and sought assistance from Marolyn's personal valet. With the Dog securely fastened and belted in the seat, the procession finally headed on. But as he pulled away, Rawat glared at me from the other car with a look of absolute disgust and disappointment.

When I got home and thought back about what happened, it just didn't add up. Where was the understanding, love, kindness, trust, friendship, or even the rational and reasonable thought behind that experience? I had just sacrificed about a week of my time, travel and expenses, hours of effort cleaning the car, planning, waiting around, and running errands for the sole purpose of serving Rawat. What it boiled down to for him however, was that a few of his own self absorbed impatient minutes had been wasted because of my fumbling around while trying to hook up a car seat for his Dog! After that I started to regularly pour over the ex website and read every word of it, repeatedly. Finally I settled in to following the forum. That seemed to be where the real action was happening. Then I read a post that outlined the "14 reasons" listed on the website in response to comments from a premie. That's when I wrote my first post where I basically wanted to say, If you think those are good reasons to leave Rawat, try this one!" The rest is on the record here with more to come. Thanks everybody.

12th September 2009 - Re: More Good Questions…

"Does anyone ever talk back to him? Does anyone ever disagree with him? Does anyone ever tell him, "No,"?"

Thanks again Marianne. These are more really good questions that I need to think about (now that my mind is working again). I'll try to reply sometime this weekend.

13th September 2009 - Answer: The Real Rawat

"Does anyone ever talk back to him? Does anyone ever disagree with him? Does anyone ever tell him, "No,"?"

Rawat is the most self centered and self absorbed person that I have ever met. Looking back and thinking about the conversations and experiences I remember, they ALWAYS somehow revolved around him. Mention any topic and he would voice his opinion with little regard for anything or anyone else. Ask him a question and it would immediately become an opportunity for Rawat to steal the stage and pontificate in a consistently pompous and self righteous manner. His explications were laced with critical and demeaning comments that were arranged to bolster his self worth while reinforcing himself as the ever present and omnipotent source of authority in any matter whatsoever. At the same time, nothing was ever good enough for him. He could instantly express displeasure or harsh criticism at his slightest whim with a single word or subtle expression. At other times, if provoked above his unreasonably low threshold of tolerance, Rawat might choose to psychologically and emotionally destroy someone.

The strange result was a wide "gap" or perceived distance of separation, where it seemed as if Rawat existed on the other side of an invisible line. He was not one of us. Instead Rawat ruled from a different sphere of reality. His world was always just out of reach. We (premies) would never be able to really understand it or get to it ourselves. All we could do was see it from a distance and hope that with good fortune or good behavior and effort, some of his wisdom or blessings would spill over across the "gap" and mercifully onto the rest of us. The attraction to Rawat was the HOPE that the "gap" would someday miraculously close or at least diminish to the point of having meaningful contact with him. Then, we too would have at least limited access to his vast stores of wisdom and experience, understand his critical view of the rest of the pitiful world, and live happily in a state of self realization, peace, or fulfillment. This was, in a nutshell, "The Promise". "The Explanation" for this gap was that Rawat had to be God.

Rawat's superior attitude and degrading nature are perceptively evident in his public addresses, Q and A sessions, expression events, and side comments at programs. We've all seen glimpses of these characteristics, even though he does a pretty good job of covering them over with a well cultivated layer of charm. But in private, these qualities dominate his personality and have an incredibly dramatic influence on those who are physically around him. The result for believers is total submission. Rawat maintains complete and utter control and domination over those who abandon themselves to his dogma. Premies close to Rawat that I've seen, would NEVER even think of talking back to him, disagree with him, or tell him "no". Its just out of the question. Rawat is clearly seen as all powerful. The worst possible outcome imaginable would be to become a source of his displeasure. Underneath the facade of love and compassion lies the real source of Rawat's power and control; Fear.

Even as he has mutated his brand from actually proclaiming himself as God, to today's more watered down version as an International Humanitarian promoting world peace, the "gap" is still there. In a previous post I summed it up by saying, "the thread that connects the lies is that Rawat bestows priceless gifts. The giver (Rawat) maintains power and control, while the receiver (us) submits." There exists the "gap" that he still uses today to seduce and prey upon those throughout the World who are the most vulnerable. Once seduced, it is fear that the priceless gifts he alone can bestow will be withdrawn, or that the "gap" will widen, that keeps the innocent entrapped.

The truth is that Rawat is just a horribly flawed individual who is intoxicated by adoration and addicted to it. He is so horribly flawed that he cannot even begin to function in a socially acceptable manner. That's why he lives in almost total isolation, surrounded by a small contingency of fanatical and totally devoted followers. He never participates in social activities and other than his stage appearances is essentially a recluse. His movement between areas of protected cover is fast and meticulously calculated, all under the disguise of personal security. Its real purpose however is to protect Rawat from his own emotional insecurity. He simply cannot function outside of the false delusional world of his own creation. My thought is that, underneath it all, Rawat is really the one driven by internal fear; he's deathly and secretly afraid he will one day be exposed as the true manipulative fraud that he really is. Then the "gap" will close in on him, and he'll be revealed as just one of us, only of the extremely psychopathic variety.

14th September 2009 - Re: Could you be a bit more specific

Hi Ocker, All the premies that I knew had no idea that this or other similar events had been set up as part of a legitimacy campaign. Since only a very small number of us were selected to go, even being asked to sit in the audience was considered to be a very special honor. It was a sure sign that Rawat trusted ME above the millions of others who would probably do anything to go as his honored guest. I remember now the phone call when I declined the invitation. The premie on the other end of the line just could not imagine that I would say no to such a rare and privileged offer. The reason I didn't go had to do with conflicts in my schedule plus the fact that it just wasn't that special to me. I had plenty of other ongoing opportunities to be with him, so I felt my personal quota for Darshan was routinely and fully satisfied.

When I watched the video of the event later, the premies I knew who went as plants, were concentrated in the front rows with a few sprinkled about the audience. Those I didn't recognize, I assumed were students or professors. It could have been that the Sociology Department was required to attend the "seminar" for class credit! Anything to fill those seats! I'm "embarrassed" now when I think back to how warped my mind must have been when I was in the cult. As the fog is lifting, the most difficult part for me is processing not so much HOW I could have been sucked into the cult, but WHY did I stay for SO long? My true feelings about that involve a lot more than embarrassment, but I'll save that topic for a later post.

Per your earlier post, Rawat spoiled his kids rotten with donated money he deceptively diverted to himself. Who knows how many premie's kids went without, so his kids could have anything they wanted. If that's the measure of a good father, then he was outstanding. As far as having any good qualities, I doubt it. Its hard for us to imagine, but Rawat has no conscience. Therefore he functions with a completely different moral compass. To him, doing good is when he wins and he doesn't care what happens to anybody else.

15th September 2009 21:52:46 - Thanks for asking, Marianne

Hi Marianne, and thank you for your very respectful concerns about approaching me with continuing questions. The fact is, part of me just can't seem to get enough good stimulating interaction here, while another part seems to get stretched a little too thin at times. My guess is that those feelings are part of the healing process, and probably pretty natural and to be expected. It does seem best to try to comfortably pace myself as I sort through all of this.

I do want to respond to your questions however. When combined they basically seem to add up to an analysis of my perspective, understanding, and opinion of the ex-site compared to what I was thinking about the cult, while I was still a premie. Sounds very interesting and I'm curious what I have to say about that myself!!! Of course all this has me thinking again, and as before, request your kind patience while I'm sorting this out. Thanks.

18th September 2009 - Have not forgotten your question Marianne

When combined they basically seem to add up to an analysis of my perspective, understanding, and opinion of the ex-site compared to what I was thinking about the cult, while I was still a premie".

This is really important. If we can figure out what I was thinking right before I left, it may help indicate what still keeps others hanging on today. That might help better expose Rawat's current struggle to rally those who he still controls. My case is a little unique because I departed so recently, after so long, and after being so close to him. There is nothing worse for a narcissist then to be fully exposed and then revealed as insignificant.

20th September 2009 - Just another Red Ocean…

"When combined they basically seem to add up to an analysis of my perspective, understanding, and opinion of the ex-site compared to what I was thinking about the cult, while I was still a premie".

After thinking about it at great length, what's really at the heart of this and of much more importance, is the real question; "Why did I leave?" As I've read and posted here and sorted through a lot of disturbing emotions, it's starting to become more clear. I simply just slowly stopped BELIEVING. At the same time I knew that others like me had gone through a similar process and were talking about it on the ex-site. As I blindly groped to understand what I was feeling and thinking, the entire foundation of my belief system crumbled. At that point, my rational mind engaged, and it somehow made sense to search for good information. I found it here. No longer could I prop up my trembling convictions about Rawat by traveling to a program, doing some service, darshan, or a little deeper and longer meditation. Although scared, worried, and very alone, I had to finally know.

God - "the supreme reality; the Being worshipped as the creator and ruler of the universe; a being or object believed to have supernatural attributes and powers and to require worship." (Miriam-Webster Dictionary)

I fully BELIEVED Rawat was God. I'm also certain that ALL of his true followers and devotees believe it too. Of course today, in the West at least, that belief is unspoken except behind closed doors. But it is still fully understood and expressed amongst believers, with a wink and a nod. There is even a particular glancing smile secretly recognized between devotees that says, "yes, we are the lucky ones who know."

When I joined the cult back in 1973 it all lined up and made perfect sense. Just like in a fairy tale, at 21 years old and about to face the hard challenges of adult life, here comes God himself to take care of all that. It was better than just the plain old boring God however. It was even better than those stuffy Messiahs I'd heard about who had periodically dropped in on the planet for a quick visit in the past. This time, and to add to my great fortune, HE was coming from the East as a child, followed by an entourage of bald headed orange robed Indian saints, graciously handing out the gift of enlightenment (Knowledge). And to top it all off, following HIM was guaranteed to be fun! It just could not get any better. Except for the fact that it was even FREE! Yes indeed, Rawat was the real thing. I would have been absolutely crazy to pass up this one and only chance in an eternity of lifetimes. Even though my instincts felt something strange, I placed those evil doubts aside and bowed down on a filthy auditorium floor to his garland draped picture.

There is a new concept sweeping the world of business called "The Blue Ocean Strategy". Of course the concept is not new, its just that it has now been named, branded, and supported by books, videos, seminars, websites and all kinds of marketing technology. Basically it says that in the extremely competitive world of business, real success comes by creating a new market SPACE. When this market space is uncontested by competitors, there exists a wide, vast, calm, and beautiful Blue Ocean. The business who arrives first at the shore of this ocean will have it all to themselves. Right beneath the sparkling smooth surface lies potentially fantastic wealth. It is all there for the taking but only for a short while. Soon, others will hear and see about it and swarm the waters, making them red with the blood of competition. Eventually, as the fresh idea becomes diluted and contaminated in the market, it dissolves and becomes just a commodity. There are NO permanent Blue Oceans. Successful companies must diligently and continuously search for the next Blue Ocean and be the first to arrive. Otherwise they will eventually fail.

One of the stories from the original book called "The Blue Ocean" is ironically about the Circus business. For decades, the circus was about elephants, tigers, clowns, trampolines, and a high wire act. Tickets were cheap and the tents smelled like a mixture of sawdust, manure, and popcorn. Then came Cirque Du Soleil. They found a fresh opportunity and created an entirely new idea about the circus. They designed their circus for a new market and found a big, blue ocean. Starting from a group of 20 street performers who got together in 1984, they now have 4,000 employees working in 200 cities in 40 countries around the world. Ninety million people have each paid up to $200 for a ticket to see the circus!

Flavored Vodka. Vodka was supposedly invented in Russia for its medicinal purposes centuries ago. It became the standard drink in colder climates because it was cheap and didn't freeze. Then in 1986, someone at Absolut actually created and bottled an idea called "Peppar Vodka". It was plain old Vodka flavored with some jalapeno peppers, tomatoes, and herbs. Their sales exploded and other flavors were quickly added along with promotional bottles and massive marketing efforts. Today, there are dozens of flavored Vodkas competing fiercely for our dollars. Twenty something years ago, the market did not even exist. Absolut however, just sold for $11 Billion.

The conclusion to all of this is quite obvious. Rawat found a Blue Ocean. He did it by accident. Most businesses actually do just stumble onto Blue Oceans by accident. Rawat's product with all its trappings, landed in the Western market at just the right time. He was flooded with tremendous success and wealth. But he had no strategy and no supporting infrastructure. Besides he is a stupid businessman who lives in a deluded self absorbed reality. As the novelty of the idea lost its luster and he made many devastating strategic mistakes, his fake product became exposed and his attraction has long since faded away. After all there are only so many suckers out there. He's also proven to not be smart enough to come up with a new or better idea. He's essentially finished. Its just a matter of time until those who believe in his original pitch about being God, either give up or die off. There will never be another Blue Ocean waiting for Rawat like the one he found. He has become insignificant.

Back to Marianne's original question that I took the liberty to rephrase. I think what REALLY got to me after 34 years however, was the gnawing voice in the very back of my mind that kept whispering; "Hey listen up stupid, if he really WAS God and came here to save the world, don't you think he would have gotten along with it by now???"

29th September 2009

Hello Daw and nice to hear from you. Thank you for your interesting perspective. How about helping us out per the Happy Birthday Marolyn thread below? We're all wondering how Marolyn is doing and how all that "for his family, because he loves them" stuff is working out for her. I'm particularly curious about whether Rawat is housing his girlfriend in Venice Beach or if he sends Marolyn to the Beach house when he brings his girlfriend up to the big house on the hill. These things can just get confusing at times. I'm sure we would all appreciate a little follow up on this and any other "loving family stories" you could share. Thanks again.

3rd October 2009 - Surviving the wreckage

"Having found "the answer," I really did stop growing in many ways."

Wow! Lakeshore, your post exactly expresses what I've been dealing with lately. Leaving the cult has been like walking away from a train wreck. It's been quite a shock. One minute I'm rolling along full speed, fastened securely in a first class seat towards what I thought was my true destination to fulfillment in life. Then, feeling a few bumps and rumbles, suddenly the whole thing derails and winds up in a smoking pile of metal, glass, and debris. Worse yet, I'm not sure what happened or even where I am. Dazed, confused and in a state of shock, I get up, shake my head, realize at least I'm still alive, and start to walk away groping for direction. Then I hear some friendly voices a little ways off in the distance. "Hey, we're over here!!! Come on you can do it! You've got to take the first few steps but reach for our hand! It's safe over here. Welcome! What's your name? Jasper? Its gonna be OK!!! We're the lucky ones, we've made it! There's plenty of time to talk about what happened. Just be thankful you're alive. There are others still trapped in the wreckage."

So, here I am, damaged and shaken up, but OK. Still alive and feeling pretty lucky to have gotten out of that mess with all that I have and another chance. And I'm finding out that with this other chance I need a different reference point than the Engineer of that train I was on. He was standing at the station seductively waving to young innocent people like me, to get on his train. It all looked fantastic but was full of false promises. The only mistake I made was to believe him and take a seat. Once on the train, the doors locked shut and I was bound for a trip to nowhere or the wreckage I found myself crawling out of. I'm glad now for the train wreck and that I'm still alive and have found other survivors like all of you. It might have been the only way to get off of the Rawat Express.

I want my new reference point to be different this time. There is so much to be thankful for, and I'm finding that when I can connect to gratitude, my life is full of wonder. Yup, I did "lose" 34 years of otherwise normal development when I was on that train ride. But, after walking away, I'm finding out that there a few real advantages. For one, at 57 years old and with a fresh start, its pretty exciting to discover all the cool stuff I missed during those lost years. And I've actually picked up a little wisdom in that I will be VERY careful about any other train I might be tempted to board. I've found I really like people and try to appreciate and understand them for who they are; not by how closely they resemble some cut-out doll pattern drawn by Rawat. That alone is absolutely wonderful. And when I can stay with that reference point of gratitude, fear seems to just go away. Fear was what kept me clutching desperately to my seat as that train flew along. The insidious fear that Rawat would be displeased and suddenly throw me off his train to nowhere. What a relief to be able to just let go and live without that fear. What a joy to be free and know that I've been given a fresh start.

Thanks to you all and yes Lakeshore, I understand, always did forgive you, and truly appreciate everything you bring to this forum and to my new chance at life!

4th October 2009 - "Hard nut to crack"

"maybe this is why it hasn't worked for you, like many others? am i right to think you received the techniques of knowledge? some people open, bloom, more easily, others are hard nuts to crack!"

Guess it was just all my fault. Something made me internally resistant to the true effects of Knowledge or else I'm just one of those poor unfortunates who couldn't really open up to the grace of Maharaji. Didn't matter that I got up at 5:00 am everyday to sit on the floor of my closet, or wherever I was, to actually practice Knowledge for 34 years. Or on weekends when I'd add several hours to a practice session just for extra measure. How about the thousands of hours spent in Satsang or following Rawat around the world with the added benefit of being consistently offered one of those special front row seats. Maybe I just didn't get it when I sat right next to him a hundred times in a car chatting away about all kinds of stuff. Or when I had free reign at the divine residences in Malibu, Reigate, or Delhi, even staying for days in his Holy guest house. Maybe something just didn't rub off on me as I spent many nights in hotels where he slept right on the other side of a thin wall. Or I should have done a better job while I was trying to help 6 year old Daya find her lost pet spider. Guess I just wasn't connecting to Holy Name when I flew in his Gulfstream jet. I thought for sure all that money I donated would help too; more money than most people will see in a lifetime. Maybe I got confused and thought he was my friend; the kind of really good friend that I would have taken a bullet to protect! But hey, a little more Satsang from one of those thoughtful, concerned premies above might straighten me out. Of course, there is always an outside chance that even a hard nut like me might crack, if I just finally get it right as I take my last breath…….

4th October 2009 - Friendly Voices

"Then I hear some friendly voices a little ways off in the distance. "Hey, we're over here!!! Come on you can do it! You've got to take the first few steps but reach for our hand! It's safe over here. Welcome! What's your name? Jasper? Its gonna be OK!!!"

I kind of got choked up myself when I wrote this part. Who else but friends like you could possibly even begin to understand. Thanks for being there and reaching out your hands! Btw, just ate a blueberry muffin and it was fantastic! Much tastier than any of that sinus cavity residue and without a whole lot of drama and sincere effort. Just popped it in my mouth and had that totally fulfilling muffin experience. Life can be just wonderful all by itself! (also, sometimes I get a little busy during the week, check in here when I can, but try to catch up with you on the weekends; I'll be around and have lots of stories to share as they come up. Thanks again!)

11th October 2009 - Answer for Ocker

"When you think back on it, did you actually see him as brilliant, unselfish, loving, etc or did you see him much as you now see him but explained it away as being a fault in your perception or a lack of understanding"

Rawat put on a great facade for a long time. He is extremely careful about anyone who gets even remotely close to him. It took about 20 years of seeing him several times a year before he let down his guard around me and really slipped up. Most of the times I saw him or talked to him, he was very distant and nearly impossible to engage. There were a small handful of selected topics we would talk about. Most of his comments were highly opinionated and his attitude was very patronizing. In hindsight, he would simply spout off as if he was an authority on just about anything. Because anyone around him was basically in a stupor, he could easily get away with that.

Most premies around him were entrapped in a mind state that is hard to describe. I've never seen anything like it. It went far beyond just a "yes sir Maharaji" attitude. It went far beyond respect or adoration and really is almost best described as a state of self induced shock. Most people were just stupefied and unable to communicate or express any real congruent ideas. There was a pervading numbness of mind or dulled and completely suspended sense of feeling or thought in most premies that surrounded him.

Try to imagine for a minute what it would be like for Rawat to be constantly surrounded by people in that condition. It would have to be like living in a science fiction movie or an episode from the old "Twilight Zone" T.V. series. For him it has to be like being the only person alive who knows what's actually going on in a world full of animated puppets. Even more insidious is to think that he was the one who held the strings to those puppets. Rawat was the force that could totally control and direct the puppet's actions and even their feelings by just pulling on their strings.

For some reason, I just don't think I ever fully and totally succumbed to that frame of mind like most premies around him. I was serious about Knowledge and diligently practiced it with discipline. To me, Knowledge was the way to enlightenment. Being around Rawat in person was an added benefit and privilege that hopefully would support and boost my practice of Knowledge. Naturally I felt the more I could be around him the better. But I think that after many years, he eventually saw me as someone that he could relate to on a more human level, and just got careless. There were a few other rare premies I knew who remained relaxed around Rawat as well, and he would also loosen up with them. I'm sure that if Rawat was as isolated from people as described above, he might have actually craved a little real human contact.

The foot kissing policy at the residence changed from time to time. There were periods when it was OK for a premie to dive for his feet at will. But then there were other periods when all that pranaming interfered with daily activities. During construction of the new mansion, Rawat needed to move around freely to check on things and make decisions, so blatant foot kissing was suspended. I remember being there towards the end of construction, while there were still several premies finishing various projects. At one point a group of about 8 or 10 of us were assembled in an accessory office when Rawat walked in unannounced. Everyone stood motionless in a circle while he made some jokingly critical comments. Suddenly, a brave premie closest to him dove for his feet and planted a kiss. Everyone looked on in anticipation of Rawat's reaction. Since he seemed OK with it, the next premie on his right followed suit. Rawat kept talking so it appeared to us that he was going to allow a full round. Each premie sequentially took his turn until it finally came around to me. I was the last in the circle and will never forget what happened. For some reason, I just stood there in apparent defiance, and looked at him. He looked back with a curious expression that seemed to say, "Well here's your chance! What are you going to do?" He then made some meaningless casual comment about pressure washers and started to walk away. As he passed by me, he turned and looked over his shoulder. With a scowl that expressed both dismay and disgust, he made it perfectly clear how displeased he was with my apparent lack of full submission.

For years I beat myself up over it. I remember flying home and agonizing about what an awful and ungrateful premie I must be. How could I have passed up an opportunity like that? Surely I would pay for it some time either in this lifetime or another. But nothing really ever happened. The next time I saw him it was as if it had never occurred. No one else who was there apparently even noticed. They were too blissed out, consumed by their own good fortune.

Looking back, I'm not sure why I chose to pass on the foot kissing that day. But it may have been a temporary expression of the residual doubt that finally set me free from the cult. Now, as I write this, I'm finally glad I chose to stand tall and firm instead of bowing at his feet. Maybe, he felt there was a remnant of humanness still left in me that could understand how pitifully human he really was. Maybe that's why he carelessly let down his guard a few years later, and sat laughing at the world, totally drunk in the back seat of my car. Maybe he thought I'd understand his bad behavior, and just like a couple of regular guys, he guessed it would all be OK. Well, maybe he should have guessed again.

19th October 2009 - Thanks Cynthia and Lakeshore!

Your comments really fleshed out what I was trying to say. That last post I wrote dug up some intense feelings and I appreciate both of your thoughtful responses.

"How incredibly toxic to turn us against our own feelings, emotions and mental perceptions." - Well said Lakeshore!

Yesterday I stumbled on a "Words of Peace" broadcast on a community cable T.V. channel while I was trying to find a football game. There sat Rawat, all perched up and as self righteous as ever. He was pontificating about how everything we do is because we are searching for fulfillment and HE has the unique and special power to simply give it to us. His supporting argument was basically that its just like thirst that only water can quench; blah, blah, blah. How this absolutely STUPID comparison ever made sense to me, I may never understand. But stupid it is, and all any of us has to do is think about how far Rawat stretches these ridiculous examples. With the right inflection, pause, cadence, and staging, he begins to appear profound to his mesmerized listeners.

But as I watched objectively, it became clear by his words and presentation, exactly what he was trying to do. First he set up his message with the "I have what you are looking for" statement followed by some supporting examples. Then he proceeded to explain that "our bodies are just dirt". From there he boldly, arrogantly, and critically expanded that to the all inclusive grandiose statement, "everything in the world is just dirt too". I could not believe he actually said that, but he did!

Now I suppose one could argue in Rawat's defense by saying that he really didn't mean "dirt". Instead, he was referring to the periodic table of elements where natural substances combine to form a mixture that is sometimes referred to as dirt. This of course is only being presented by Rawat as a contrast to the purity of Knowledge that only he can bestow.

But, as I listened to Rawat explain it, he definitely meant "dirt" in the full and total context of filthiness. Implied in his use of the word "dirt" is an offensive and repulsive reaction. His purpose was clear and it connects to the theme of this thread of posts. Rawat's strategy is to "turn us against our own feelings, emotions, and mental perceptions" and REPLACE these wonderful natural qualities with a total dependency on HIM. From there, he gains complete control of his followers (us) to be manipulated for whatever purpose he so desires; usually money, services, and adoration. We then become his source of narcissistic supply and the innocent victims of his self promoting cult.

20th October 2009 - Re: our bodies are just dirt

Thanks Snow White! I have wanted to see that exhibit and heard its fascinating.

But what really got me about Rawat's comment was the tone in his voice when he said the word "dirt". It was said with disgust and contempt and in a derogatory way. Almost like he was bashing the competition. To paraphrase, it was as if he was saying, "There is MY Knowledge which only I can bestow, or there is everything else which is just as filthy and disgusting as dirt. Take your pick."

I guess that's Rawat's way of explaining completely out of context, the idea of "ashes to ashes", which basically comes from a funeral ceremony. In Rawat's world its either "Knowledge or dirt", or put another way, its either "all perfect anyway or it doesn't really matter."

Unfortunately, there were many major life changing decisions I made where I followed the Rawat dogma that "it doesn't really matter". Looking back now, it appears that it did in fact matter, and many of those decisions have turned out to be terrible errors in judgement. This twisted way of thinking and the damage it creates may be the most devastating effect of Rawat's self promoting cult on his unsuspecting and innocent victims.

24th October 2009 - Re: Honesty, Kindness, Independent Thought

Thank you Mike!!! I read most of the book in one sitting and it was like watching a movie of what happened while being in the movie at the same time. A little hard to explain but kind of like turning on the flood lights in a dimly lit room. All of a sudden I was able to see things much more clearly. Its a fantastic story told by someone who was really there and exposed to the real danger of it all; but then survived to tell it from the more human perspective of honesty, kindness, and independent thought. Kind of interesting to think that Rawat's world is the exact opposite of this; lies, selfishness, and manipulative control. Thanks again!

6th November 2009 - Re: Re: Oh Ocker! - you forgot to include the ordering form.

My previous version Bone China cup blew up when in a moment of waivering consciousness, I ran it through the dishwasher.

15th November 2009 - Re: Short paragraphs (OT)

I appreciate everyone's posts and look forward to the time I can find to read them and write some of my own. Been a little busy lately without much to say, but I want to thank everyone for your thoughts and efforts to promote the truth.

17th November 2009 - Re: Relationships

Each one of us has an invisible thief that follows us wherever we go. What does the thief do? He robs us. Neither doors, nor locks, nor alarms can stop him. This thief does not take money or clothes. He robs us of the most valuable assets we have. He robs us of joy, peace, contentment. He robs us of understanding. He robs us of all those things that are much more important than anything else.

When we say, "I want peace in my life, but … I will pursue it later," we give permission to this invisible thief to come in. This is his signal. All he has to hear is, "Not now," and the thief says, "Here is someone I can rob, because he is not protecting his most valuable asset. He is squandering it. He is throwing it away." And in that moment, we are robbed of what is most important to us.

This quote from Rawat was taken off the TPRF website and it pretty much sums up the way Rawat manipulates the thinking of his followers for his own selfish purposes. His strategy in saying this is to clearly use "divide and conquer" tactics to create a dependency on him. First, he boldly states that there is something inside of us that we don't even know about that is destroying our lives. He creates an image of deceitfulness and fear by calling it a thief. In the same context, it's implied that we need help to protect us from the thief, who is really a part of ourselves. Of course, Rawat alone, is identified as the one who will protect us from the thief, or in reality, protect us from ourselves.

The idea is to replace self trust and self reliance with complete dependency on Rawat. It worked very well with me when I was at a vulnerable age and was searching for my own identity and future direction. He arrived at a time when I was faced with making some critical life impacting decisions. I blindly followed him and Rawat himself became my reference point. My dependency on Rawat grew and was reinforced by the dogma, structure, and rituals of the cult.

This distrust in myself and dependency on Rawat became the foundation of my decision making process for the next 3 and 1/2 decades. The consequences of many of my decisions were tragic to say the least. Rawat is clearly to blame for his intentional predatory actions to take control of his victims and for the influence he had on critical decisions that determined the future outcomes of their lives.

I'm really pissed off about it…..

19th November 2009 - Re: Reply

Thanks for your comments! I crafted a lengthy reply to this thread last night that dug a little deeper, but unfortunately when I pressed "post" it all disappeared. Don't know what happened and not sure I have it in me to rewrite all that. But if I find the resolve, I'll give it another try. Essentially it was a description about the power struggle and politics within the Rawat organization as premies close to him scratch and claw to win Rawat's favor. On second thought, it could make a good header, so I'll try again over the weekend. Thanks for all of your continued support.

Per the above more recent threads, a special thanks to Lakeshore and others for expressing all of that painful detail about the ashrams. It needs to be said for everyone's benefit but I have to think its got to feel good for you too. As for myself, I'm feeling a little locked up lately, which is probably part of the healing process. Just reading everyone's posts is extremely cleansing so thanks again to all.