Mahatma Gurupujanand aka Initiator Ira Woods- NATIONAL -


Whilst on tour of New Zealand,Mahatma Gurupujanand was interviewed by our man-on-the-moment. Below are excerpts from Mahatma Ji's satsang.

How do you reach the understanding that Maharaj Ji's talking about?

By opening up to it. How do you really understand that fire is burning? Someone could come along and tell you don't put your hand in the fire because it will burn you and if you really open yourself up to what that person is saying you could understand that it's a dangerous thing. Maybe you've never experienced it but you can accept it and you won't do that. Then of course you can go ahead and stick your hand in the fire and really understand what that person is talking about but then you'll get burned.

Understand Guru Maharaj Ji. Understand what he's saying. He's saying this Knowledge is the most important thing in our life, to realise this Knowledge. Do we really believe that or not? This is the point. If we don't believe it then there's no understanding there. We might go around saying that. We can get up in front of everybody and say dear brothers and sisters, this life is to realise God blah, blah, but how much do we really feel that inside, that that's what we really want to do? How much do we really understand that.

It's always that experience of perfect peace which we're searching for and that's within us. To come to that understanding, we live our life, we try out many things in this world, nothing satisfied us, we come and we hear Guru Maharaj Ji's satsang, we really hear and we really see a lot. Yes, the answer's within and I should receive Knowledge.

Then we receive Knowledge but still there's so many other layers, so many other trips above our head that that understanding isn't really complete.

Maybe we woke up to Knowledge but then we have to wake up to the fact that we really have Knowledge and how do we do that? Once you're open to the fact that this is true Knowledge, this is reality, this is everything, this is the real Truth, this is Knowledge of God, perfection, that all the scriptures talk about through all the ages, which everybody has searched the four corners of the earth for, which people mutilated their bodies and starved and did so many things for, if we can just understand that then wow, this is it, it's inside me, then, Boom, you're right on your way.

You go ahead and all your energy goes in that direction, towards realising what that means, serving Guru Maharaj Ji, doing satsang and you meditate, following Guru Maharaj Ji's Agya. Then there you are, it's just beautiful, just from that understanding alone you're on easy street, because you know your direction, you're not striving to get anything outside anymore. You've got it and so all of your energy goes right there. The search is over and a lot of people have Knowledge but they're still searching and they don't realise it.

This is where all the problems come in because we have


Knowledge but it's really tricky because we all go round saying "Oh, the search is over" but mind's still wandering in the world. The mind's still thinking, still looking for many different things.

Mahatma Gurupujanand aka Ira Woods in 1975 If you're doing service, satsang and meditation and it's just not connecting, what is someone doing wrong?

Well, there can be two things to this. When I hear people say this, the first thing I have tell to them is, "Look, either one of two things is possible. Either this whole thing is completely wrong, this whole Knowledge business and Guru Maharaj Ji and everything that's happening is completely false or you're not doing it properly". I find that people don't do it properly. If this is true Knowledge, it's inside of us, what's the big deal? You don't have to go too far, it's right there. In order to experience that Knowledge all we have to do is concentrate ourselves inside.

Some people I find say they're doing service, they say they're doing satsang, they say they're doing meditation but it seems like they are doing their own brand of service, satsang and meditation. Like for service, they go round saying anything is service, all I got to do is remember the Word and anything I do on the Word is service and then they go ahead and they're not even on the Word anyway, not even practising that technique anyway and they're just running around the world following their ego rather than surrendering their own ideas to Guru Maharaj Ji and serving him.

Serving Guru Maharaj Ji by propagating this Knowledge, by cooperating with the Mission, by helping support the Mission, by giving people satsang and by then aiding themselves by going in and meditating. Some people don't do service and they think they're doing service. But actually they're doing service to their ego. They're just following their own direction and not following Guru Maharaj Ji's direction at all.

Then they say that everything's satsang. Satsang comes off the TV because people are talking, people are looking for Truth and then satsang comes out of "Autobiography of a Yogi" and satsang comes out of so many different places and Guru Maharaj Ji made it very clear at the festival in Orlando what satsang was. He said these three people can give satsang. Guru Maharaj Ji can give satsang, Mahatmas can give satsang, and those premies who are obeying Guru Maharaj Ji's Agya and are experiencing this Knowledge, they can give satsang. Satsang is the true communication. When someone is in satsang and they're brought to that consciousness of Truth, they are in the company of Truth and they understand for themselves and they feel for themselves what the purpose of their life is, that's what satsang does. It makes a person really understand this purpose of this life and of course only the person who's surrendering to a Perfect Master can give satsang. Likesome people just call anything satsang and they're not giving satsang so what happens is they're not doing service so they're not really doing satsang, so how can they meditate? They sit down and they think and they they call that meditation. I sit, they say, I sit in meditation 8 hours a day and so 8 hours a day they sit there with a sheet over their head and they think and they sleep. So that guy's not experiencing anything and when a person doesn't experience anything in this Knowledge it's because they're just not doing it properly. Instead of meditating they're thinking.

We can all experience a little bit of this Knowledge. Also many premies have attempted to compare their experience to other people. I've met people like this who've been telling me they don't see any light and they're really unhappy and what they really mean to say is that they didn't see Krishna in his infinite form last night, they only saw ten thousand suns. It's like they've seen light but they're not happy with that light because the mind's always looking for something more, the mind can never be satisfied with the experience that we're having. First we have to be honest with ourselves and enjoy the experience of this Knowledge that we're having right now.

Enjoy the experience of doing satsang, service and meditation that we are having right now and get into that because only when we reach that point where we're in this moment and we're practising Knowledge at this moment and we're satisfied with this moment, can we progress in this Knowledge and get more and more and more. I mean here's our soul, our beautiful soul that's just all bliss and happiness and love and there's so many layers around it. We've got so much garbage piled up and if we're doing satsang and if we're doing service, enough of those layers are being taken away, Guru Maharaj Ji's just ripping all the darkness from us and then if we sit in meditation that light will shine brighter and brighter and brighter.

Sometimes it takes a little bit of time, it takes a little bit of work, a little bit of effort but even when a person's putting in all that effort, still he's experiencing something. But we've got to work hard enough to rip a lot of those things away. Everybody, absolutely everybody can experience this Knowledge. It's a very simple thing because it's inside of us. It's not like we're creating a Knowledge to meditate on or anything, it's already inside of us. The big deal is that we have to concentrate ourselves inside. If we're concentrated into the world, how do we experience the Knowledge, it's impossible.


If I'm looking in front of me, how am I ever going to see what's in back of me? I'm going to have to turn my head around and look there. So if I want to see this Knowledge then I have to turn around, concentrate inside and focus my attention there. This is the only way to do it. And the only way you can have the ability to do that is by Grace. And once we have the Grace it's very simple.

Prem Rawat aka Maharaji dressed as the God Krishna in 1975 Do you see any major area in which the New Zealand premies can strengthen themselves?

The whole purpose of a community, a community is like a shelter for the premies living in it but a community exists to propagate this Knowledge. This is what Guru Maharaj Ji wants to do. Like he put it in one conference, he was saying that 'Look, I'm a premie serving my Guru Maharaj Ji and you're premies serving your Guru Maharaj Ji' and he was saying his service is to spread this Knowledge to the whole world. Everything he's doing right down to wherever he goes, right down to anything he owns, right down to anything he does, is to propagate this Knowledge. He's serious, he's into it one hundred thousand percent.

Then he turns around to us and says 'Okay, I'm going to let you give me a hand' and if we love Guru Maharaj Ji at all, if we have any feelings about Guru Maharaj Ji at all, we really know that this is what he wants to do. It becomes our responsibility to go out and tell people but the thing Guru Maharaj Ji is emphasis-mg at this time is the community because community is a very good way, a very good means of helping to propagate this Knowledge because it's where everybody comes togeher. They come together in service, in satsang, in meditation.

They come together over Truth and when a community together based on that Knowledge, based on Truth, then it's so beautiful that the true love is there throughout the whole community. Everybody's united and that unity and that love is what is so attractive, and when another person walks into that he feels it. Not only that but he'll be able to get clear satsang.

He'll be able to take this Knowledge and not just be in some spaced out little place. Communities have to unite themselves around this one thing, around this Knowledge and really see that the purpose of their lives is to go and realise this Knowledge and then the reason they're coming together like this is to tell other people. It isn't like a social affair where we come together to have tea and biscuits. This isn't why we have Divine Light Mission, this isn't why we receive Knowledge. We received this Knowledge and we're meditating on it so that other people in this world can do the same thing.

Why did only four people receive Knowledge on this trip?

Because only four were ready. Maharaj Ji doesn't want any seeds to be wasted. This Knowledge is the most precious seed. Back in '75 at a Holi Festival in the United States, Guru Maharaj Ji gave a satsang and he said that we don't want to take this precious seed and throw it out in the middle of the road. It's for us to understand how precious that seed is and to make sure it goes to the right hearts where it's going to grow right and bloom the best. So that's our duty, all of us together. Maybe the Mahatma comes around and by Guru Maharaj Ji's Grace reveals the Knowledge to the aspirant but really we're all involved in the same task of making sure that this Knowledge goes to the right heart. We're all brothers and sisters doing the exact same service, making sure this seed goes into the right soil and so if the community is not together the soil isn't going to be good and even if the soil is sort of right; if that seed is given who knows what'll happen to it.

Finally, have you any darshan stories? There was one you gave about driving Maharaj Ji from the airport.

The only darshan story is that when we gain darshan from Guru Maharaj Ji, we should appreciate it. There's lots of darshan stories, they're just stories but what we want to understand is the purpose of our life. Because we can live and we can die and if we don't understand what to do in between those two points then we've completely wasted the whole thing and Guru Maharaj Ji, whether a person gets darshan from him or not, is trying to make us understand that point. Constantly.

That we shouldn't waste this life, we've got a human body, we've got the Knowledge, we've got Grace, we've got Perfect Master, we've got beautiful brothers and sisters, we've got everything we need. Now we just have to put ourselves into gear. Do service, do satsang, do meditation, don't even get our heads into anything else.

Just go straight towards that goal. Because this is a chance that's given to us, it's a beautiful chance but if we really don't trust this Knowledge, if we're really not into this Knowledge, then of course we're going to be bored. Our mind's going to be wandering, we'll be all over the place. We should just try to understand Guru Maharaj Ji really really carefully, that's the most important thing.